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Post by tomdavis76 on Jan 5, 2013 19:16:55 GMT -5
The thing that makes me wonder about Dariusz is why he continues to post at Manzella's and put up with the widespread, knee-jerk hostility towards him and anything he posts. That he bothered to come over here to bitch about Mann's post (that only 19 people will ever see) yet stays put over there to be regularly humiliated before thousands is puzzling, to say the least. Remember the special post that BM started to discuss Dariusz ideas and it just became a way for everyone to dump on him, think it was finally deleted. I felt that was unfair. That's the type of thing I was thinking of. I banned cloran from jeffygolf because of how he acted in one of those threads.
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Post by bullet on Jan 6, 2013 9:49:42 GMT -5
Wow this thread is now just plain stupid moronic rubbish . Jeff you publicly call Dariusz an idiot then ban him and have his posts deleted , that is ridiculous . Seriously , I was going to ask him how many times Kelley mentioned forward shaft lean and handle dragging in the book . Have a vodka on me D
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Jan 6, 2013 11:02:05 GMT -5
Bullet,
You may find the situation ridiculous, and if you want you can stop participating in this forum.
Rand has kindly responded to my request to become the "moderator" of this forum and I am now capable of deleting any post that I find unacceptable - such as Dariusz's posts and Nate's photo-post.
I didn't call Darius an idiot - I called his opinions re: golf swing swing biomechanics/mechanics idiotic (wrong-headed). I have nothing against Dariusz as a person, and I was not making an ad hominem attack against him as a person. He then joined this forum and made a number of personal ad hominem insults directed at me (as a person), and not directed at my opinions re: golf swing mechanics/biomechanics. That type of behaviour is unacceptable in this forum - and you know that fact. I therefore deleted all of his posts. He had the option of strenuously criticizing my opinions re: golf swing biomechanics and TGM mechanics (as you encouraged him to do), but he was only concerned about demanding an apology when I never really insulted him personally, and he continued to attack me with further personal ad hominem insults. Hopefully, Rand will ban him from this forum - because his continuous barrage of uncivilized insults (eg using the word "prick") is totally unacceptable in this forum.
This is the only golf forum where there is no restriction on criticizing another forum member's opinions re: golf swing biomechanics and mechanics and one can label those opinions ridiculous, wrong-headed, moronic or idiotic - without fear of being banned. However, one cannot call another member "stupid" in a global sense (as being reflective of a general attack against his character). I attacked his opinions re: golf swing biomechanics and called them idiotic and I never attacked his character-as-a-person. He took the opposite approach - and if you cannot tell the difference, then that's your problem.
As the global moderator, I am now going to delete more posts, and parts-of-a-post, if I believe that they are not related to a debate/discussion re: golf swing mechanics/biomechanics/testing. For example, Jeffy and cwdlaw223 are at loggerheads, and they are introducing irrelevant comments in their posts about scoring ability (eg. can you break 80). Those type of comments are merely insults and I will not hesitate to delete them in future. Secondly, if I find that I have to spend a lot of time deleting ad hominem insults from a forum member's posts, then I will likely ask Rand to ban that forum member. I am going to do everything possible to avoid having this forum become an uncivilized forum where there is an endless pattern of back-and-forth insults - as happened in the Gotham Golf Blog forum, which was never moderated. However, I will never restrict any forum member's ability to post the most aggressive/severe/strenuous criticism of any other forum member's opinions re: golf swing biomechanics/biomechanics.
Jeff.
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Post by dariusz on Jan 6, 2013 14:16:32 GMT -5
So before the owner of the forum bans me out on your request I will add one more thing, Jeff. You have offended me and do not turn things upside down saying that you did not. It is eventually the offended person who decides if he feels offended and not you. You did not title the thread e.g. "Idiotic opinions of Dariusz" but literally "Idiocy of Dariusz" which means simply I am an idiot. I have recieved some messages about your uncivilised behaviour and there is NOONE I know who would share your crooked point of view and your double morality in the worst sense.
I am seriously disappointed with you.
Bullet, thank you. Tell me where we can develop our future conversation about TGM/MORAD. I will gladly learn a thing or two, as said.
Peace all,
DJ
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Jan 6, 2013 16:35:24 GMT -5
Dariusz,
I have decided to leave your last post unedited and I will also not delete it - although I disagree with your attitude and perceptions.
You wrote-: "You have offended me and do not turn things upside down saying that you did not. It is eventually the offended person who decides if he feels offended and not you."
I disagree with your whole line of reasoning. I am not disputing that you "feel" offended, but that doesn't mean that I intended to offend you as a person. It is obvious to me that the target of my post was your opinions re:golf swing biomechanics/mechanics, which I think are wrong-headed (idiotic).
Secondly, you wrote-: "You did not title the thread e.g. "Idiotic opinions of Dariusz" but literally "Idiocy of Dariusz" which means simply I am an idiot."
Again, I disagree with your line of reasoning - which is self-serving. It could be that because English that is not your natural tongue that you are wrongly equating the words "idiot" and "idiocy". The word "idiot" applies to a person and the word "idiocy" applies to an attitude/opinion held by a person. The word "idiocy" was simply a short hand for the contents of my post - which was targeted at your opinions re: golf swing biomechanics/mechanics, which I think are idiotic and I have never implied that you are an "idiot" (as a person).
I frequently use that same term "idiocy" with respect to BM because I think that his opinions re: golf swing biomechanics/mechanics are idiotic (wrong-headed, nonsensical, incoherent, irrational, illogical). I don't bother with personal attacks against a person anymore - because all my posts are increasingly targeted at golf biomechanics/mechanics issues.
Thirdly, you wrote-: "I have recieved some messages about your uncivilised behaviour and there is NOONE I know who would share your crooked point of view and your double morality in the worst sense."
You, and those other people, are entitled to your partisan perspective - which I think is wrong-headed.
As I have previously stated, I have no objection to you posting in this forum as a new member as long you follow my long-standing rules - i) you can strongly/thoroughly criticize my opinions re: golf swing biomechanics/mechanics/testing and you can call them nonsensical or idiotic, but ii) you cannot indulge in ad hominem insults targeted at the person.
Jeff.
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Jan 6, 2013 18:12:56 GMT -5
Jeff -
Dariusz is right and you're wrong. I bet if your children (assuming you have any) called you an idiot that you wouldn't intepret that to mean they think your opinion is idiotic. They meant you are an idiot. Just because you were obviuosly rude to D doesn't make it right. If you can't figure that out then you live a sheltered and screwed up life. Try to post without using adjectives. I bet you can't do it. The title of your post was rude and Dariusz should have been offended. The guy did nothing to you and you attacked him. Dariusz isn Brian.
You should lead and follow your own rules instead of trying to try to argue away the obvious which is you personally attacked Dariusz with your post and the guy did nothing to you. Act like a man and contact him personally if you have a problem with his views.
(My act like a man comment is directed to your opinion! I don't intend to offend you just like you didn't intend to offend Dariusz. You're wrong headed if you think I was commenting about you personally).
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Jan 6, 2013 20:27:52 GMT -5
cwdlaw223, You wrote-: " Dariusz is right and you're wrong." That's a personal opinion and not a fact. I also think your personal opinion is wrong-headed. You also wrote-: " I bet if your children (assuming you have any) called you an idiot that you wouldn't intepret that to mean they think your opinion is idiotic." You are totally wrong. I would immediately look into the context as to why they made that statement - and that context would be related to some act/opinion that I manifested. So, for example (based on a true experience), if my niece stated that I was an "idiot" because I expressed an opinion that she should not label "homeless drunks" as being unworthy citizens who should be shunned and scorned for beng "drunks", as her school friends (peers) recommended, then I would realize that she was simply implying that my opinion was "idiotic". I am not a complete idiot who cannot differentiate "being truly offensive" from "being perceived as being offensive". Consider an example. I have been a life-long atheist, and according to some radical Islamic individuals. that means that I have rejected their "true" religion and that would make me an infidel (in their eyes), and they would be so offended by my choice-to-be-an-infidel, that they would recommend that I be beheaded. Do I need to apologize for offending them? I don't "feel" any need to apologize to them - no matter how sincerely they express their "feeling" of being offended. In fact, I find it personally offensive when a religious person thinks that his personally chosen religion-of-choice is morally more valid than my moral decision to be an atheist. However, I don't waste my time asking religious people to apologize for offending me when they state that I am being immoral when I deliberately choose to be an atheist. Get "real"! You also wrote-: " The title of your post was rude and Dariusz should have been offended. The guy did nothing to you and you attacked him. Dariusz isn Brian." You are free to express an opinion, but you are not free to infer that an opinion is an incontrovertible fact. It's incontrovertibly true that I attacked Dariusz's opinions re: golf swing biomechanics/mechanics. but that's what I do every day in this forum. I attack many people's opinions re: golf swing biomechancis/mechanics, but that does not mean that I am making ad hominem attacks directed at a person's character. You also wrote-: " My act like a man comment is directed to your opinion! I don't intend to offend you just like you didn't intend to offend Dariusz. You're wrong headed if you think I was commenting about you personally." I partially agree with you and and that's how I perceive your comment - as reflecting your opinion about my behaviour (expressed opinion). If I really thought that you were insulting me unnecessarily, then I would label that an ad hominem insult, and you would likely be banned from this forum. However, I am also not easily fooled and I can easily recognize the underlying sentiment - so be very careful how you express yourself in future if you do not want to be banned from this forum. Finally, If you cannot really differentiate between my behaviour (which you perceive as being offensive) and truly offensive conduct (see this Jeffy forum thread - jeffygolf.com/showthread.php?553-IS-JEFF-MANN-THE-BIGGEST-FUCKHEAD-ON-THE-PLANET) then it is my opinion that you have a major problem. It may also explain why you seemingly condoned, and contributed to Footwedge's endlessly offensive harassment of Tapio in the Gotham Golf Blog forum. In fact, you once sent me a PM asking me why I wasn't joining the Tapio-bashing process. Do you want me to post that PM in this forum? Jeff.
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Post by cwdlaw223 on Jan 6, 2013 21:25:24 GMT -5
Don't piss on a person's leg and tell him it's raining.
I figured you as a Russell/Flew/Camus/Dawkins combination. It permeates your thinking. You probably think the problem of evil is why there can be no God.
Huge difference fighting with a stranger vs. a known enemy. Darius's never started a fight with you (maybe it did happen years ago - you only post here now from what I gather). Tapio starts fights with everyone.
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Jan 6, 2013 21:39:19 GMT -5
You wrote-: "Huge difference fighting with a stranger vs. a known enemy. Darius's never started a fight with you. Tapio starts fights with everyone."
The fact that you infer that Tapio is a legitimate enemy and that it was morally legitimate to endlessly attack him in an offensive manner in the Gotham Golf Blog is very reflective of your "true" character.
You also wrote-: "Don't piss on a person's leg and tell him it's raining."
That's an unadulterated ad hominem insult, and I will now request that you be banned from this forum. In the interim period, I will delete all of your future posts as soon as I discover them, and seeing that I visit the NGI forum about 4-5X/day, any future post made by you will only be temporarily present for a few hours.
Jeff.
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