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Post by imperfectgolfer on Apr 8, 2011 18:39:32 GMT -5
MK,
Do you have visual evidence that Tiger is using a mid-palmar grip? The only golfer who I have seen using a mid-palmar grip was Moe Norman.
Why do you think that a mid-palmar grip makes it more difficult to square the clubface? I believe that there is less clubhead travel per unit degree of left forearm rotation when using a palmar grip (relative to a finger grip) and that should make it easier to square the clubface when performing a release swivel action (when completing the release of PA#3).
Jeff.
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Post by monkutare on Apr 8, 2011 19:56:28 GMT -5
no photos but it was discussed on a show with Haney.
try the grip yourself. then report back.
my golf coach (instructor) showed me that grip to hit high soft pitches
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Post by aimsmithgolf on Apr 8, 2011 20:14:42 GMT -5
no photos but it was discussed on a show with Haney. try the grip yourself. then report back. my golf coach (instructor) showed me that grip to hit high soft pitches monkutare, Is this what you would call mid palmar gripping of the club? And you contend this grip makes it harder to square the clubface? www.aimsoft.com/download/golf/midpalmar flexion.png[/img] Rand
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Post by monkutare on Apr 8, 2011 21:05:50 GMT -5
no higher in the palm and not as diagonal giving you a one knuckle grip looking down at address
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Apr 8, 2011 23:21:23 GMT -5
MK, You wrote-: "try the grip yourself. then report back". That's a ridiculous comment. I have tried all the grip variations many years ago, and I am familiar with their effects on the degree of clubhead travel per unit degree of PA#3 release. Here is a mid-palmar grip. It results in less clubhead travel per unit degree of left forearm rotation, and it is therefore easier to square the clubface. Some golfers therefore use this grip for chipping/putting. Other than Moe Norman, I know of no other golfer who uses it for a full golf swing. Jeff.
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Post by richie3jack on Apr 8, 2011 23:21:45 GMT -5
Makes it harder if you have more #3 PA. Less #3 PA, like Nicklaus, not hard.
3JACK
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Apr 8, 2011 23:27:44 GMT -5
3jack,
You wrote-: "Makes it harder if you have more #3 PA."
That's an assertion and not an explanation. Why should it be harder to square the clubface when using a palmar grip (relative to a finger grip) if a golfer has a significant amount of PA#3 release?
Jeff.
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Post by natep on Apr 9, 2011 3:09:42 GMT -5
Is Ritchie saying that Tiger is holding it like a baseball bat, and not like the pictures you put up Jeff? I'm confused about what he means by more #3. More #3 angle?
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Post by aimsmithgolf on Apr 9, 2011 7:37:15 GMT -5
Count me as another one confused about the same, natep. Jeff isn't the image i posted above close to your example? You seem to have the club angled less it appears.
Rand
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Apr 9, 2011 9:21:47 GMT -5
Rand, Your photo and mine are essentially the same - the club's grip goes across the mid-palm and over the heel pad (hypothenar eminence). In a low palmar grip, the grip goes below the heel pad, although it is still within the palm. Low palmar grip Natep, I believe that the amount of PA#3 involved depends on the amount the left arm/forearm rotates in the backswing, and therefore downswing, and it doesn't depend on the accumulator #3 angle. That angle determines the amount of clubhead travel per unit degree of PA#3 rotary release - and that angle is exaggerated with a lower handle at impact. If the handle is higher, and the clubshaft is more in a straight-line relationship with the left forearm, then that accumulator #3 angle is decreased, and it decreases the amount of clubhead travel per unit degree of left arm/forearm rotation. That should make it easier to time the squaring of the clubface as a result of the release swivel action (release of PA#3). I think that zeroing-out the accumulator #3 angle is a major factor that allowed Moe Norman to consistently hit straight shots - because it makes it easier to accurately time the clubface squaring phenomenon. Jeff.
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Post by aimsmithgolf on Apr 9, 2011 10:32:26 GMT -5
Now I know what grip I am using this season and WHY! Mid Palmar! Thanks Jeff!
Rand
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Post by gmbtempe on Apr 9, 2011 12:39:41 GMT -5
Based on the pictures I would say I use a low palmer grip.
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Post by natep on Apr 9, 2011 13:24:03 GMT -5
Jeff,
I agree with what you are saying. But why would Ritchie think that a mid palmer grip would make it harder to rotate the forearm than if the grip was in the fingers? To me it seems like it wouldnt make a difference at all. I thought he must have been implying that Tigers palmer grip led to a lower handle and more #3 angle, which could make it harder to square the face up.
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Post by imperfectgolfer on Apr 9, 2011 19:57:51 GMT -5
Natep,
You wrote-: "I agree with what you are saying. But why would Ritchie think that a mid palmer grip would make it harder to rotate the forearm than if the grip was in the fingers? To me it seems like it wouldnt make a difference at all."
I agree - it should not make it harder to rotate the left forearm if one adopted a mid-palmar grip (rather than a finger grip).
You also wrote-: " I thought he must have been implying that Tigers palmer grip led to a lower handle and more #3 angle, which could make it harder to square the face up."
If Tiger adopted a palmar grip, rather than a finger grip, it should decrease the accumulator #3 angle and thereby elevate the handle, and that should make it easier to square the clubface during the release swivel action (release of PA#3).
Jeff.
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Post by natep on Apr 9, 2011 20:24:34 GMT -5
I agree. But Ritchie's thoughts on this led me to believe that perhaps he thinks Tiger's "haney" grip is a palm grip, but not diagonal across the hand like the mid-palmar grip you showed, and more like a baseball bat grip with the shaft more perpendicular to the fingers.
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