|
Post by imperfectgolfer on Dec 27, 2012 12:01:17 GMT -5
Here is Virtuoso's swing Here are capture images from the video I think that he has a superb golf swing and I think that he is a poster-child example of a golfer who can swing perfectly with a FLW/intact LAFW throughout his downswing and followthrough. Note that he has a GFLW and intact LAFW at his end-backswing position - image 1. Note how he maintains a GFLW and intact LAFW during his early-mid downswing (images 2 & 3) while he slots his intact power package. Note how he releases his club within the plane of his LAFW between P5.5 and P6.6 and there is no tumbling motion of his GFLW/club during this time period (image 4). Note how he maintains a FLW/intact LAFW through impact to at least the P7.4 position (image 5) and there is no pre-impact/thru-impact/post-impact flipping action. I cannot think of a better example of how to demonstrate the "virtues of playing golf with an intact LAFW/FLW". Jeff. p.s. Also, note how fluidly he performs a left hip clearing action and there is no "apparent" deliberate pelvic slowing in his late downswing.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 27, 2012 13:48:08 GMT -5
Jeff,
Thank you for the nice comments. I hold your opinion in high regard.
There are a few improvements I'd like to make over the next couple days. I think the swings i posted in the video after this one are actually a little better. In this video, my transition is a little out of sync so my right arm starts to fall behind me (almost punch) at P5 and then my right shoulder is too high at impact.
|
|
|
Post by imperfectgolfer on Dec 27, 2012 14:12:26 GMT -5
Virtuouso,
I personally believe that if a golfer is a swinger, who has a perfect motion of the intact LAFW/FLW from P4 to P7.4 (like you), that it often doesn't matter whether the right shoulder motion and right elbow motion and right arm motion is perfect - because the right arm is often passive in a golfer who uses a full-roll hand release action through impact. If you are trying to use a no-roll hand release action between P7 and P7.5 combined with a CP-arm release action, while maintaining a bent right wrist, then it becomes much more important (from a biomechanical perspective) to perfect one's right shoulder motion, right elbow motion and right arm straightening motion in the late downswing => early followthrough.
I don't necessarily think that your right shoulder is too high at impact - given that you do not seemingly have much secondary axis tilt and much lateral bending - but I would need to see a face-on view video to better study those features of your swing action.
Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 27, 2012 14:21:40 GMT -5
I think those are fair points Jeff. I've definitely always been a swinger.
I'll get some face on views on video so you can have a look-see.
|
|
|
Post by gmbtempe on Dec 27, 2012 14:59:42 GMT -5
Great swing...something looks off in image 4, maybe just camera angle.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 27, 2012 18:02:37 GMT -5
I don't necessarily think that your right shoulder is too high at impact - given that you do not seemingly have much secondary axis tilt and much lateral bending - but I would need to see a face-on view video to better study those features of your swing action. Face-on view 3-iron www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gCpwLlFtX0
|
|
|
Post by imperfectgolfer on Dec 27, 2012 19:12:05 GMT -5
Virtuoso, Your video frame rate was too slow, so I could only capture three images between P6.5 and P8, and none were at impact. I don't think that your right shoulder is too high as you get near impact (image 1) - given that amount of secondary axis tilt. However, I note that you have a small degree of pro-flipping at the P7.2 position (image 2) and you use a full-roll hand release action early (image 3). Note that your torso doesn't turn much through impact. I don't know if that is a deliberate choice - considering that you stated in your video commentary section (of another video) that you are trying to flip through impact. Your swing action through impact reminds me of Louis Oosthuizen. Image 3 shows him at impact. Note that he has standard impact alignments - straight left arm and FLW, slightly bent right elbow and slightly bent (dorsiflexed) right wrist. Image 4 shows how quickly his right arm has straightened, and how quickly his right wrist has flattened, through impact. Note that it is causing the club to flip passed his FLW. Note that his left forearm has also supinated slightly during that time period and that has allowed his right hand to pronate over the top of his grip. In other words, it is likely that Louis is starting to roll his left wrist very soon after impact. Image 5 shows that his club has flipped passed his left wrist, which is probably bent. In other words, the biomechanical combination of i) slowing of the forward motion of his FLW combined with an ii) over-active right arm/wrist straightening action has caused him to flip soon after impact. I much prefer Dustin Johnson's full-roll hand release action. Image 1 shows Dustin Johnson at impact - note that his FLW and clubface is facing the target. Image 2 shows him at the P7.3 position - note that his FLW and clubface is still facing the target, and he hasn't yet started to perform his full-roll hand release action. That allows him to maintain a stable clubface that is square to the target through the immediate impact zone (from the P7 position to the P7.2 position). Note that his clubshaft is straight-in-line with his left arm, which means that he has an intact LAFW. Note that he still has a bent right arm and bent right wrist - which is only possible because his right shoulder is moving actively downplane and under his chin, so that he doesn't run-out-of-right arm. Image 3 shows him at the P8 position where he has completed his full-roll hand release action. He has delayed his full-roll hand release action. To look like DJ, you would have to be rotating your shoulder sockets more actively through impact, and you would have to be pulling your FLW towards the target post-impact (in a drive-holding manner) to avoid flipping. I wonder whether your hand release swing pattern through the impact zone is a deliberate choice (possibly being influenced by BM's pinata-release action philosophy) or whether it is non-deliberately due to a slowing of the forward motion of your FLW through impact combined with an over-active right arm straightening action combined with some upper torso pivot stall through impact. Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 27, 2012 19:27:25 GMT -5
jeff, I think that's a great analysis. Thanks for taking the time to do it. I'll give you more frames next time. I'm definitely not doing it deliberately. My feeling is that I start down with my torso before my arms complete the backswing, so then the hips/torso run ahead. Then my torso slows rapidly to let my arms catch up--kind of a one-two move. Then I get a quick arm roll early. But I think a lot of what you said is valid also. Here are some up the line views for fun. I'll work on it and post some more vids. www.youtube.com/watch?v=NSckSpzg9gA
|
|
|
Post by imperfectgolfer on Dec 27, 2012 19:46:37 GMT -5
Virtuoso,
What's your ball flight pattern? Are you happy with the results?
If your ball flight is close-to-perfect on a consistent basis, then it is hard to criticise your slight tendency to flip-roll soon after impact. Louis Oosthuizen plays at a very high professional level - even though he is a flip-roller.
I am personally biased in favor of drive-holding through impact - even for a golfer who uses a full-roll hand release action (like you). However, you may not be sympathetic to my personal biases if you favor BM's "ideas about the release" beliefs.
Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 27, 2012 20:01:45 GMT -5
Jeff, I hit the ball pretty consistently but I'm not playing in any tournaments so I like to keep tinkering. I generally play a baby fade.
Also, my swing is primarily an experimental lab so I can test things and know what to teach other folks.
I'll explain what I meant by drag and then flip when I get more time to explain what I think I've learned by watching Mac O'Grady's old swings.
|
|
|
Post by gmbtempe on Dec 27, 2012 21:24:26 GMT -5
I always thought Mac wanted the right shoulder higher than what is generally taught, especially in a CP type pattern.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 28, 2012 11:12:01 GMT -5
Jeff, Took another vid in slo-mo. It's a little better I think. My swing radius was narrowing in transition, partly due to sequence and partly due to my feel for positioning...and I think lead to some of those things you talked about. What I'd like to get is what you might call an under-flip. I would like slightly less arm roll but keep some. I have been wondering why I felt like I couldn't get back to the ball with what I felt was the right downswing pivot action, and I think the narrowing of the radius in transition was partly to blame. In this vid, I think the wrists are scooping under slightly more just post impact and the arms rolling slightly less. I also think the upper torso rotation is staying in sync with the arms swing better through impact. I absolutely flushed it this morning with perfect flight so the results are also encouraging. www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGLBaqJIdI4
|
|
|
Post by imperfectgolfer on Dec 28, 2012 13:44:40 GMT -5
Virtouso, That's a better quality video because there are more frames/sec through impact. Here are capture images. Image 1 - you have excellent impact alignments - FLW and bent right wrist with a small amount of forward shaft lean. Image 2 is soon after impact - you can see that your FLW is still facing the target and your LAFW is still intact. That is excellent because you are maintaining a stable clubface through impact. Image 3 shows you in the next frame - and at this point, you have flipped. You have also rolled your FLW counterclockwise. My conclusion is that you do tend to flip-roll after impact. However, if your timing is perfect then an after-impact flip-roll motion is not going to deleteriously affect your ball-striking because it is happening well after impact. Flip-rolling becomes a problem if it happens during impact. If you want to decrease the chance of flip-rolling through impact, then you have to decrease the biomechanical factors that predispose to that problem - i) slowing of the forward motion of the FLW through impact; ii) any active right wrist straightening through impact and iii) any active right forearm pronation action through impact that induces a counterclockwise rotation of the FLW. I cannot see anything significantly wrong with your swing between P4 and P7 that requires remediation. I think that you have a tour quality swing action - for a golfer who uses a full-roll hand release action and CF-arm release action. Your swing action is obviously unsuitable for a golfer who uses a CP-arm release action combined with a no-roll hand release action (like Hogan). You would have to radically alter your swing if you want to efficiently/fluidly perform a combined CP-arm release action and no-roll hand release action. Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by virtuoso on Dec 28, 2012 15:36:32 GMT -5
Thanks Jeff! I appreciate your thoughts and observations.
|
|
|
Post by cwdlaw223 on Dec 28, 2012 21:13:49 GMT -5
Virtuoso -
Good swing. You've obviously played in competition before. You don't develop that swing on a range IMO.
|
|