|
Post by imperfectgolfer on May 1, 2020 9:11:07 GMT -5
UG,
You wrote-: "The robot has no shoulder turn or torso rotation, and only simulates independent left arm motion. It is obviously good at testing golf shafts, but can it serve as a proxy for the human body?"
It can serve as a proxy for the PA#2 release phenomenon that happens passively due to the laws of physics (D'Alembert principle) where the changing hand arc path is causally responsible for the release of PA#2. Many golf robots also have a pivoting hinge joint where the club attaches to the central arm that can serve as a proxy for the passive release of PA#3 phenomenon. Some golf robots have an offset shoulder attachment, but that does not simulate "reality" because the central arm does not change its relationship relative to the offset shoulder's attachment arm (= clavicle) in the plane of adduction => abduction as happens during the release of PA#4.
Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by utahgolfer on May 1, 2020 11:30:58 GMT -5
DG, no apologies needed. You are amazing and your inquisitive approach is a wonderful benefit.
Jeff, isn’t it true the robot has vertical drop and horizontal tug simply due to the inherent shape of the swing. Unlike a robot, however, the human body can add right lateral bend to help or early horizontal shoulder turn to hurt. Obviously our muscle activation and associated movement or stability can help or hurt us, so the ultimate swing is a net effect. In addition, joint range of motion capacity and coordination differences also adds more swing variety across players. This makes it difficult to suggest a cookie cutter swing as we compare Jon Rahm and Jamie Sadlowski and Moe Norman.
I know you allow for individual swing differences and focus on delineating the ideal biomechanics. You know a pivot driven left arm is essential and you know the vertical drop is also essential. However, they need done at the same time in almost two different worlds. Can you bridge the gap and suggest the common ground between these two worlds, and how they can be done simultaneously? Do you think the key is somewhere between Rahm and Sadlowski, and a player simply has to practice until the correct blending of movements can be achieved by a given player?
UG
|
|
|
Post by utahgolfer on May 1, 2020 18:22:48 GMT -5
Jeff, it seems like it would be helpful to see the path of the right elbow from p4 to p6, from a DTL view from various PGA pros (using your spline tool). This could show the initial vertical drop and how the right elbow path moves from a steeper to a more shallow path as the downswing progresses.
UG
|
|
|
Post by imperfectgolfer on May 2, 2020 9:29:04 GMT -5
Jeff, it seems like it would be helpful to see the path of the right elbow from p4 to p6, from a DTL view from various PGA pros (using your spline tool). This could show the initial vertical drop and how the right elbow path moves from a steeper to a more shallow path as the downswing progresses. UG I don't think that it would be beneficial to plot the path of the right elbow between P4 and P5.5 in pro golfers because it will naturally be variable - because some pro golfers (eg. Sergio Garcia) shallow their clubshaft a lot while other pro golfers (eg. Phil Mickelson) do not shallow their clubshaft; and among those who shallow the clubshaft between P4 and P5.5 there are some (eg. Sergio Garcia) who drop their right elbow earlier and at a faster speed between P4 and P5 while other pro golfers (eg. Henrik Stenson) drop their right elbow more gradually and more evenly between P4 and P5.5. You also asked-: " I know you allow for individual swing differences and focus on delineating the ideal biomechanics. You know a pivot driven left arm is essential and you know the vertical drop is also essential. However, they need done at the same time in almost two different worlds. Can you bridge the gap and suggest the common ground between these two worlds, and how they can be done simultaneously?" Again, there is tremendous variability among different pro golfers (eg. Sergio Garcia versus Henrik Stenson) that one cannot rationally prescribe any particular pattern of combining the pivot-induced release of PA#4 with an active right arm adduction maneuver. Jeff.
|
|
|
Post by utahgolfer on May 2, 2020 11:51:48 GMT -5
Jeff,
i still think showing the path of the right elbow would be instructive, especially in comparison across tour pros. It has implication with vertical drop and the PA#3 angle. Visualizing how the pros do it would help a golfer know it is far from horizontal, yet not literally vertical either as the name implies. I'd be happy to do it if you could provide instructions or tell me which program you use.
in answering my own question, I think learning to pivot drive the left arm and vertical drop the right arm simultaneously is related to walking and chewing gum at the same time. It just takes practice and neuromuscular coordination, all possible with increased awareness and the knowledge learned from Dr. Mann.
UG
|
|