Post by imperfectgolfer on Sept 19, 2023 12:04:51 GMT -5
Here is the latest BBG video featuring Milo Lines.
The main purpose of this BBG video, according to Brendon Devore, is to discuss the concept of how to efficiently maintain clubhead lag to P5.5+ - see Brendon at the 0.55 minute time point of the video demonstrating his P5.5 position where he has retained a clubhead lag angle of ~90 degrees. There is also a side-image showing Milo Lines retaining ~90 degrees of clubhead lag at his P5.5 position.
At the 1:35 minute time point of the video Brendon states that some golf instructors believe that clubhead lag just happens and that it is not a direct consequence of a certain number of biomechanical elements being performed by the golfer (and I obviously strongly disagree with that opinion). Milo replied that most pro golfers do maintain a large degree of clubhead lag at P5.5, but he never discusses how it is accomplished from a biomechanical perspective.
In fact, Milo diverts immediately to a discussion of the clubface alignment at P5.5 - see the 2:00 - 2:09 minute time point of the BBG video where Milo demonstrates a ~90 degree clubhead lag angle at P5.5, which he implies is a "wrong" position because he believes that his lead wrist is too cupped at his simulated P5.5 position. Milo asserts that having a cupped lead wrist at P5.5/P6 will cause the clubface to be too open at P5.5 and that it will lead to shanks or sliced shots secondary to an open clubface at impact.
The main purpose of this BBG video, according to Brendon Devore, is to discuss the concept of how to efficiently maintain clubhead lag to P5.5+ - see Brendon at the 0.55 minute time point of the video demonstrating his P5.5 position where he has retained a clubhead lag angle of ~90 degrees. There is also a side-image showing Milo Lines retaining ~90 degrees of clubhead lag at his P5.5 position.
At the 1:35 minute time point of the video Brendon states that some golf instructors believe that clubhead lag just happens and that it is not a direct consequence of a certain number of biomechanical elements being performed by the golfer (and I obviously strongly disagree with that opinion). Milo replied that most pro golfers do maintain a large degree of clubhead lag at P5.5, but he never discusses how it is accomplished from a biomechanical perspective.
In fact, Milo diverts immediately to a discussion of the clubface alignment at P5.5 - see the 2:00 - 2:09 minute time point of the BBG video where Milo demonstrates a ~90 degree clubhead lag angle at P5.5, which he implies is a "wrong" position because he believes that his lead wrist is too cupped at his simulated P5.5 position. Milo asserts that having a cupped lead wrist at P5.5/P6 will cause the clubface to be too open at P5.5 and that it will lead to shanks or sliced shots secondary to an open clubface at impact.
At the 2:34 minute time point of the video there is written message on the BBG video screen that states-: "clubface is the missing key to maintaining lag". That statement makes no sense to me because clubhead lag is the angle measured between the lead arm and the clubshaft in the plane of lead wrist uncocking ( plane of lead wrist radial => ulnar deviation) and I know of no "evidence" that a skilled pro golfer can better maintain clubhead lag at P5.5 if the lead wrist is either i) neutral, ii) cupped or iii) bowed at P5.5. All those 3 wrist alignments at P5.5 are compatible with a skilled pro golfer's ability to efficiently maintain clubhead lag at P5.5.
Watch the BBG video between the 3:19 - 3:30 minute time points of the video where Milo makes the outrageously wrongheaded claim that if a golfer gets to the P6 position with a cupped lead wrist, that the face will invariably be too open and that he will consequently be presenting the hosel of the club to the ball. Milo then also wrongheadedly claims that the golfer can then only get a square clubface at impact by performing a pre-impact flipping maneuver.
Brendon then asks Milo a question about what he is looking for when he teaches a student-golfer on how best to maintain clubhead lag at P5.5/P6 - and Milo answers by stating that he looks at the i) clubface and the ii) chest alignment. Between the 5:43 - 6:20 minute time point of the video, Milo demonstrates the incorrect way (manifesting an overtly cupped lead wrist at P6) versus the correct way (manifesting an overtly bowed lead wrist at P6) that a golfer could potentially manifest at P6.
At the 6:45 minute time point of the video, Brendon talks about having a "green light" clubface alignment at the P6 position where a golfer can then just rotate his pelvis/upper torso from P6 => P7 (into impact) without having to use a hand manipulation technique to square the clubface. Milo then demonstrates the technique that he personally uses to accomplish that goal between the 6:50 - 7:06 minute time point of the video where he states that if can get to the P6 position with a slightly closed clubface alignment that he can just rotate his body into impact without having to do "something weird with his arms/hands".
Here is a capture images of Milo at his P6 position - from the 7:39 - 7:42 minute time point of the video.
Note that the clubface is tilted slightly groundwards and it is parallel to his spinal bend inclination angle. That represents a clubface that is slightly closed relative to the clubhead path at P6.
Look at Milo's lead wrist and note that it bowed by ~20 degrees at P6. Milo implies that he is using a lead wrist palmar flexion maneuver to get that specific slightly closed clubface alignment at P6.
I think that Milo is totally wrong! The reason why Milo's clubface is slightly closed (relative to the clubhead path and also relative to the watchface area on the back of his lead lower forearm) at P6 is mainly due to the fact that he adopts a very strong lead hand grip at address.
Consider these capture images of Milo's P4 => P6 early-mid downswing action when swinging a driver.
The red splined path represents his hand arc path and one can see that Milo shallows his clubshaft a lot between P4 => P5.5.
Image 1 is at P4 - note that his lead wrist is slightly cupped, and not overtly bowed. However, note that his clubface is slightly closed (relative to the clubhead path and also relative to the watchface area of his lead lower forearm) due to the fact that he adopts a very strong lead hand grip.
Image 2 is at P4.5 and image 3 is at P5 - note that his lead wrist is slightly cupped, and not overtly bowed. However, note that his clubface is slightly closed (relative to the clubhead path and also the watchface area of his lead lower forearm) due to the fact that he adopts a very strong lead hand grip.
Image 4 is at P5.2 and image 5 is at P5.5 - note that his lead wrist is becoming less cupped at P5.2 and it is probably overtly bowed at P5.5. However, note that his clubface is not closing more - relative to either his clubhead path or the watchface area on the back of his lower lead forearm - as a result of performing a lead wrist palmar flexion maneuver. The likely reason is that Milo is not really performing the reverse motorcycle maneuver that can potentially close the clubface if the lead wrist is radially-deviated.
To prove that Milo's bowing maneuver is not causally responsible for his slightly closed clubface alignment at P5.5/P6, and that it is far more likely to be due to his use of a very strong lead hand grip, let's look at the clubface alignment of two pro golfers who also use a very strong lead hand grip, but who have a cupped lead wrist alignment at P5.5/P6.
Here is a swing video containing many golf swings of Matthew Fitzpatrick, who uses a very strong lead hand grip.
If you look at a number of his golf swings, you will note that MF has an overtly cupped lead wrist throughout his entire downswing between P4 => P7, and that he never bows his lead wrist.
Here is a capture image of MF at his P5.5 position - from one of those golf swing actions.
Note that he has an overtly cupped lead wrist at P5.5.
Here is another capture image of another MF golf swing action where he is at his P6 position.
Note that his lead wrist is overtly cupped. However, note that his clubface is closed relative to his clubhead path and also relative to the watchface area on the back of his lead lower forearm - to the same degree as seen in Milo's P6 position.
Here is a swing video of another pro golfer - Daniel Berger - who also uses a very strong lead hand grip.
Here is a capture image of DB at his P5.5 position.
Note that he has an overtly cupped lead wrist. However, note that his clubface is slightly closed relative to his clubhead path and the watchface area on the back of his lead lower forearm - to a similar degree as seen in the capture image of ML at his P5.5 position - despite the fact that his lead wrist is overtly cupped.
Here is another swing video of Daniel Berger's driver golf swing action.
Here is a capture image of his P6 position.
Note that he has an overtly cupped lead wrist at his P6 position.
Milo stated that if a golfer has an overtly cupped lead wrist at his P6 position, that the clubface will be too open, thereby necessitating some hand manipulation technique between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
So, let's consider DB's P6 => P7 time period.
Image 1 shows that DB has a slightly closed clubface at his P6 position - despite having an overtly cupped lead wrist at P6.
Note how easily/efficiently DB squares his clubface between P6 => P7 while continuously maintaining roughly the same degree of lead wrist cupping.
Note that the back of his lead hand continuously faces the ball-target line between P6 => P7 to roughly the same degree, and that there is minimal counterclockwise rotation of his lead humerus or lead lower forearm happening between P6 => P7 during his PA#3 release action. That's the huge advantage of using a very strong lead hand grip - that very little PA#3 release action (mainly due to lead forearm supination) is required between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
Here are capture images of MF's P6 => P7 time period.
Image 1 is at address - note that he uses a very strong lead hand grip.
Image 2 is at P6, image 3 is at P6.5 and image 4 is at impact.
Image 2 shows that MF has a slightly closed clubface at his P6 position - despite having an overtly cupped lead wrist at P6.
Note how easily/efficiently MF squares his clubface between P6 => P7 while continuously maintaining roughly the same degree of lead wrist cupping.
Note that the back of his lead hand continuously faces the ball-target line between P6 => P7 to roughly the same degree, and that there is minimal counterclockwise rotation of his lead humerus or lead lower forearm happening between P6 => P7 during his PA#3 release action. That's the huge advantage of using a very strong lead hand grip - that very little PA#3 release action (mainly due to lead forearm supination) is required between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
Note that the back of his lead hand continuously faces the ball-target line between P6 => P7 to roughly the same degree, and that there is minimal counterclockwise rotation of his lead humerus or lead lower forearm happening between P6 => P7 during his PA#3 release action. That's the huge advantage of using a very strong lead hand grip - that very little PA#3 release action (mainly due to lead forearm supination) is required between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
Finally, here are capture images of Milo Lines P6 => P7 time period.
Image 2 shows Milo at his P6 position. Note that he has an overtly bowed lead wrist (and according to the HackMotion data presented in the BBG video he likely has ~20-26 degrees of lead wrist palmar flexion at P6). However, note that his clubface is not more closed at his P6 position - when compared to MF and DB at their P6 position - despite the fact that those two pro golfers have an overtly cupped lead wrist at their P6 position.
Note how easily/efficiently ML squares his clubface between P6 => P7 while continuously maintaining a flexed lead wrist between P6 => P7 (although the degree of lead wrist flexion apparently decreases to ~10 degrees by impact).
Note that the back of his lead hand continuously faces the ball-target line between P6 => P7 to roughly the same degree, and that there is minimal counterclockwise rotation of his lead humerus or lead lower forearm happening between P6 => P7 during his PA#3 release action. That's the huge advantage of using a very strong lead hand grip - that very little PA#3 release action (mainly due to lead forearm supination) is required between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
Note that the back of his lead hand continuously faces the ball-target line between P6 => P7 to roughly the same degree, and that there is minimal counterclockwise rotation of his lead humerus or lead lower forearm happening between P6 => P7 during his PA#3 release action. That's the huge advantage of using a very strong lead hand grip - that very little PA#3 release action (mainly due to lead forearm supination) is required between P6 => P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact.
I can see no evidence that DB and MF are having to use a greater degree of hand manipulation - compared to Milo Lines - between P6 =>P7 in order to get a square clubface by impact as a result of having an overtly cupped lead wrist at their P6 position.
I believe that Milo's personal predisposition to actively use a bowed lead wrist maneuver in his downswing action is a personal/idiosyncratic/optional choice that does not make his clubface-squaring action between P6 => P7 more efficient than other pro golfers, who also use a very strong lead hand grip, but who have an overtly cupped lead wrist at P6 and where lead wrist cupping is continuously present all the way between P6 => P7.
In a future post, I will discuss what golfers, who use a weak-or-neutral lead hand grip, have to do differently with respect to having, or not having, a bowed lead wrist at their P6 position.
Jeff.